Socialist countries are failing you say?

Every time someone on the internet brings up Socialism there has to be at least one person who starts the "Socialism is bad, m'cay" routine.   It's a given.  And it seems like the all got the same mass email of "how to debate Socialism" in their inbox.  Nothing the say is ever backed up with facts.  There are no hard numbers, or in the rare case that there are numbers they are only from one side.  One I always hear is "Look at the Scandinavian Debt clock.  The Nordic countries are failing. They want to get rid of their Socialism and go back to Capitalism.

Well lets start with some Debt clocks then shall we?

http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/debtclock/denmark

http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/debtclock/finland

http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/debtclock/norway
http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/debtclock/sweden

There are the Nordic block countries and yes their National debt is swelling.  Gosh those clocks keep spinning while I watch them.  How about some of those numbers below the debt.


Denmark  -     Interest per Second - $115    Debt as % of GDP - 46.57%    Debt per Citizen $27,985
Finland  -        Interest per Second - $119    Debt as % of GDP - 59.68%    Debt per Citizen - $28,752 
Norway  -       Interest per Second - $68      Debt as % of GDP - 19.62%    Debt per Citizen - $14,419
Sweden  -       Interest per Second - $127    Debt as % of GDP - 28.09%    Debt per Citizen - $16,536


Boy oh boy those are some scary numbers.  There is no way out of it. The north Of Europe, that vast Socialist with with all their universal healthcare, free college, welfare programs.  It's no wonder they are so deeply in debt.

Of course we here are doing so much better

http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/debtclock/unitedstates

USA       Interest per Second - $16,692     Debt as % of GDP - 104.50%    Debt per Citizen - $56,797

Or maybe not so much.

If you bring this up the next thing you get to hear is that those Nordic countries have super high tax rates.  They only keep their debt down by having exorbitant taxes.   So how about that?

Finland Tax rates 2011

Taxable earned income (US Dollars)		Rate within brackets
17,332 – 25,776		6.5%
25776 – 41,997		17.5%
41,997 – 75,773		21.5%
75,773 –		30.0%

 United States Tax rates 2011

Taxable earned income		Rate within brackets
8,500		10%
8,500–34,500		15%
34,500–83,600 83,600 83,600		25%
83,600–174,400		28.%

174,400–379,150		33%
379,150–		35%

Again to be fair there are other taxes too.  In Finland municipal taxes are Fixed and vary from 16.5% – 21.5%

Just like we have state taxes the vary from 0% in some states to as high as 13% in California. 

So yes Taxes end up being a little bit higher but not as much as those attacking Socialism would have you believe.  Not when you compare what they get for those taxes.  We get no healthcare and instead subsidize the health insurance marketplace with our taxes.  While a few people are happy with the Affordable Care Act there are plenty who are not for good reason.  High out of pocket costs, large deductible and premiums that are not included in our tax rates and would start to equalize things out a bit.  Then of course there's no tuition paid be the state for college here, limited workplace protections, no mandatory vacation time.  The list goes on. 

What do we pay for with our tax money?  One of the worst performing primary school systems in the developed world, more prisoners per capita then anywhere in the history of the world. Military aid sent out to both sides of conflicts our two largest military aid packages being to Israel and Egypt. And an overall military spending budget that is higher then the next 20 countries on the list combined all of whom we have treaties with.  Even our Veterans Administration in underfunded and those many who fought to keep our country "free" get less service the the average citizen in the Nordic bloc.

But they must have more poor people right?

Well I like to look at the children first so lets quote a study done of the 35 riches countries ranked by percentage of children who live in poverty. Here is info from the Office of Research at the United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF) released in 2012

Children living in relative poverty:

Iceland     4.7
Finland     5.3
Norway    6.1


Denmark  7.3
Sweden    7.3


How about us?
We came in at number 34 out of 35
USA        23.1

In fact only two countries have more than 20% of their children living in relative poverty, Romania and the United States.


Now to be fair none of the Nordic countries are Socialist, they are mixed markets with both Capitalist and Socialist Economics being used.   In my mind this mixture of the two systems is the best way to go and I can only hope this country begins to follow this trend as mixing the two has in the past show to lead to economic growth.